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CO-Gov: Is Scott McInnis a Dead Man Walking?

by: James L.

Wed Jul 14, 2010 at 4:24 PM EDT


Is the Scott McInnis Plagiarism Story going the full Vaughn Ward?

Sources in Colorado Republican circles say it's likely a matter of when, not if, McInnis will exit the race.

"Almost without exception, they think he is done," said one senior Colorado Republican granted anonymity to speak candidly.

"He may be the last one to know it, but he's dead in the water," said another. "It's likely he will resist heavily, but at some point he's got to realize this is a fact of life."

Indeed, the bad headlines keep piling up, including the news that the foundation that paid McInnis to write his now-discredited "musings" on water issues wants their $300K back (which, by our math, adds up to $2,000 per page). McInnis' efforts to deflect the misdeeds to a researcher are being denied, and the he's also being hit with fresh allegations that a 1994 column he published in the Rocky Mountain News (and later recited on the floor of the House) was in part lifted from a column published in the Washington Post six weeks earlier.

Aaron Blake writes that Colorado Republicans are trying to find out what they can do to replace McInnis with someone more acceptable on the gubernatorial ballot. Without knowing anything about Colorado's election law, the major stumbling block would seem to me to be the fact that they're attempting to replace McInnis after the convention (and filing deadline) but before the primary -- where McInnis' only challenger is the broke-assed Don Maes. My guess is that McInnis would have to win the state's August 10th primary and then drop out in order to be replaced, but perhaps the staffers at the Colorado Republican Party will find a more legally definitive answer.

James L. :: CO-Gov: Is Scott McInnis a Dead Man Walking?
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Not to mention potential Colorado Bar discipline.
That's not helpful to a political campaign.

Storm over possible plagiarism in McInnis writings escalates

McInnis ... could face discipline from the Colorado Bar, said legal ethics professor Rebecca Aviel at the University of Denver Sturm College of Law. Colorado Rules of Professional Conduct prohibit "dishonesty, fraud, deceit or misrepresentation."
"The rule covers attorney conduct even when it does not pertain to a client or particular case," she said, noting that the rules are "under enforced."
 

If lawyers think McInnis lacks ethics
Will that be the nail in his coffin?

("McInnis. Too seedy even for lawyers.")


[ Parent ]
This is fast moving
Amazing how this is going.

I know
I very much underrated this as a scandal when it first came out. One thing I was not aware of - McInnis doesn't seem that popular with either rank and file Republicans or the Republican leadership of Colorado.  

[ Parent ]
Too Bad for McInnis
He was actually touted as a rising GOP star down the road by, of all people, some SSP contributors. If McInnis does bow out, or lose the primary, I'd say Hickenlooper's chances of being governor increases dramatically, since he only trails Maes by as few as 1 point.

I remember being relieved he didn't run for US Senate...
...now I wish he had!

NY-13, Democrat. Blog @ http://infinitefunction.wordpr...

[ Parent ]
Gale Norton
This really is a fast moving story. About possible replacements, is Gale Norton available? She's been touted by a number of people, does she have any interest?

There's some of former GOP congressmen who lost in 06 and 08 who may be interested in a run. Marlyn Musgrave off the top of my head (God forbid)?  


Bob Schaffer
He lost to Udall last year. He also lost to Pete Coors in the primary. I think Coors is the best replacement because of money. CO has a ridiculously low $500 contribution limit, making it hard to fundraiser in such a short period.  

[ Parent ]
Hasn't
the deadline passed? He has a primary challenger as well.

Proud member of the Indiana Democratic Party from IN-9.  

[ Parent ]
Yes
If he wins the primary and drops out. Or a write-in. See below for my opinions on a write in.  

[ Parent ]
Wingnuts like Musgrave
would give Hickenlooper a double-digit win.  Gale Norton would probably do so too.  A damaged McInnis would be far stronger than either of these two pieces of trash.

[ Parent ]
a write-in campaign?
That would have to be run by someone with a strong organization existing in the state already or by someone with money. Which brings us to: Bill Owens (organization) Jane Norton (organization), or Pete Coors (money). Thats the only viable option since McInnis may not even win the primary now. I bet Josh Penry is regretting his decision to drop out...

Someone upthread
mentioned Marilyn Musgrave.  I'll throw out another, Tom Tancredo.  They might have the organization and name recognition, but I can't believe either would have a prayer in the fall.  

[ Parent ]
We'd be better off
With McInnis.  

[ Parent ]
Which is what I stated above
Personally, I don't get why McInnis is being pushed out.  This really isn't that big of a deal.

[ Parent ]
I don't think it is either
But then again, I never think anything is a big deal. After the Blumenthal stuff, everyone here said it was a huge deal, I didn't think it was. I only think this is a big deal b/c everyone does, so I must be missing something.  

[ Parent ]
Plagiarism: a form of theft
In essence, McInnis stole $300,000 with his actions.

[ Parent ]
I don't understand your message
Can you clarify, please?

[ Parent ]
"This" is a form of voicing support for your argument


[ Parent ]
Whew, ty
I guess I'm showing my age.... As a published author (computer books), plagiarism is an especially sensitive issue for me.

I suspect it's also a sensitive issue for those in the press, which is why I'm guessing that media outlets will hound McInnis without mercy about his actions, at least until he withdraws from the race.


[ Parent ]
And this is why I called it a wine-track scandal
I suspect it's also a sensitive issue for those in the press, which is why I'm guessing that media outlets will hound McInnis without mercy about his actions, at least until he withdraws from the race.

The media and the elite care about this scandal, your average person who didn't graduate college probably does not.  I'm not sold that there are many Republican or independent voters who would abandon McInnis on this issue.


[ Parent ]
Let me rephrase this issue
McInnis stole $300 000.

Is that big enough of an issue?


[ Parent ]
Not really
He didn't actually steal the money, and he may be willing to pay it back.

[ Parent ]
Bank robbers who steal $300k
don't get that much leniency if they pay it back.

He stole the work -- that he then sold for $300k. IMO, it's no different than stealing something from a museum -- and then reselling it to a private collector.


[ Parent ]
Bank robbers won't
but Wall Street crooks and tax cheats get a lot more leeway and don't have to pay it back...

It is at most comparable to people who steal music and software through illegal downloading.  And the general feeling is that while it is wrong, few people think lower of a person who has engaged in illegal downloading.

I think most understand theft as someone who steals from a store or now a Madoff-type guy who steals embezzles money.  Plagiarism and illegal downloading don't pass the threshold as theft for most.


[ Parent ]
Music downloaders don't steal that much
$300,000 v. maybe a few hundred for downloads.

Which one sounds more like Wall Street?

Defending McInnis using the standards of Wall Street is not going to serve him well politically.


[ Parent ]
This is true
I guess the campaign manager of Hickenlooper or Maes should stress the big amount, and imply there is some type of corruption.  

Saying that it is theft, however, probably won't fly.  As I said, until your responses, it never occurred to me that this could be seen as theft.  


[ Parent ]
Both are forms of theft
If an author were to use the material that I've written -- and sell it,

That action would deprive me of income.

McInnis' action deprived the original author of $300,000.

(Working class analogy -- a scab who does the job of a union member -- using the tools that member left on site --also deprives that union member of income.)

If it weren't for illegal downloads of my books, I would be somewhat more well off. Illegal downloads are also a form of theft.


[ Parent ]
No, plagiarism is not theft
If you are going to talk about intellectual piracy, I might entertain that.

However, it is not theft, for the same reason digital piracy is not theft.

party: Democratic, ideology: moderate, district: CT-01


[ Parent ]
I'd love to get into how much I hate the DMCA
but it the only "practical" tool that we in the US have to defend intellectual property in the Internet age.

I can't figure out how to tie in a discussion of the DMCA to electoral politics, so I'll stop here.  


[ Parent ]
I have to say that I got a new perspective here
I think I see why McInnis' actions may be quite serious at 300K.  

If one had asked me previously, I probably would have agreed that plagiarism and illegal downloading were wrong, but I would have said that it was a minor infraction.  When I think of plagiarism, I think of copying a few lines out of a book without giving credit to a source for a paper or a speech, not copying a whole bunch of stuff for resale.  Similarly for illegal downloads, my position was that yes it is wrong, but again not that big of a deal.  I suppose that as a whole, I didn't really consider "intellectual property" the same was as I would physical property.

Although, the scab analogy is not quite there, the thing that pisses me off most about scabs is that they are traitors, rather theives.  Of course I'd be angry about losing hard earned money, but I'd be even more pissed that someone stabbed us in the back rather than fighting for a fair deal.  I certainly don't support violence against scabs, but I can't say that I would harshly condemn it either.


[ Parent ]
That said
from a political perspective, my gut feeling is that this is probably still a tough argument to sell in a campaign.  

[ Parent ]
I think we discussed some effective sound bites
that would work well in a high-tech friendly state with a substantial professional class -- and I believe also with the working class of CO.

[ Parent ]
Nope
The analogy would be to illegally copy CDs or movies and then sell them for profit. People who download MP3s aren't profiting; they simply are getting something for nothing. This guy got paid handsomely for passing off stuff he didn't write as stuff he did. You're right that many people wouldn't see it as being as serious as shoplifting or street robbery, but comparing it to individuals who download things for free doesn't wash.

"I'm not a member of any organized political party, I'm a Democrat!"
--  Will Rogers  


[ Parent ]
I think this is not only a case of plagiarism, here is added a fraud to the fundation
When a person copy writing by own initiative, he is deceiving the readers and he is damaging to the original autor. The readers lose the money what pay for the book and the original autor suffer some damage too (habitually not a big damage).

But when S McInnis write for someone what pay him $300K after sign a contract for write, S McInnis add to all that, the fraud to the people whay pay the $300K. This last is the worst detail of this case. I would understand if S McInnis must leave the race inmediatelly. I think he is KO.

I think that mean D Maes will resourge a bit and will win the primary. The teabaggers from Colorado will defeat the stablishment candidates, and that gives to the democratic candidates better chance of win.


[ Parent ]
I think you used the best word
Fraud. That's exactly what it is.

"I'm not a member of any organized political party, I'm a Democrat!"
--  Will Rogers  


[ Parent ]
lol at "average person who didn't graduate college"
this so-called "average person"...probably won't vote. you're forgetting that voter turnout is a LOT higher among the well-educated. Even though only about a quarter of the country or so has a college degree, the breakdown among voters even in a presidential year is closer to 50/50, let alone in a midterm year where the most well-educated voters will disproportionately turn out. this is to say nothing of how Colorado is easily one of the most well-educated states in the country.

21, dude, RI-01 (registered) IL-01 (college)
please help Japan. click "donate funds" in upper right and then "Japan Earthquake and Pacific Tsunami." http://www.redcross.org/


[ Parent ]
We are talking about big integrity issues here
He's made 300k by using another person's work, that is theft and is inexcusable. An executive has to have ethics, McInnis is very obviously lacking in them.

24, male, African-American, CA-24, Democrat. Chair of the SSP Black Caucus.

[ Parent ]
Governor Hickenlooper?


Proud member of the Indiana Democratic Party from IN-9.  

What a meltdown
I don't see how they could replace McInnis before the primary, since it's not a situation where another candidate didn't file.  

24, male, African-American, CA-24, Democrat. Chair of the SSP Black Caucus.

Does the CO GOP establishment
hate McInnis?  Because I don't think this is a big deal, and I don't think that many people do.  Is this an excuse for the establishment to dump a guy whom they never really liked?

According to the Cizzilla article
Yes, they really do dislike him.

26, Male, Democrat, TX-26

[ Parent ]
*Cillizza


26, Male, Democrat, TX-26

[ Parent ]
Colorado is a professional class state
This is a big deal in a state where a very large chunk of voters make their livelihood through intellectual work. And frankly, getting rid of him in this way makes for a real cluster-fuck of a mess for the Colorado GOP, so it's really hard to imagine them actively trying to get rid of him and risk a nobody like Meas getting on the ballot.

Politics and Other Random Topics

24, Male, Democrat, NM-01, Chairman of the Atheist Caucus, and Majority Leader of the "Going to Hell" caucus!


[ Parent ]
Disagree in a sense
I agree that this might not kill his chances, I do not know. However I disagree that this is not a big deal, this is a BFD. I can honestly say that I would not support a Democrat or anyone if they did this. Then again the average voter might not understand the gravity of this and I am surprised you don't. This is the equivalent of stealing hundreds of thousands of dollars and is a very serious offence. If you spent a large amount of time creating something that you were very proud over and someone stole it and gained a large profit on it are you telling me you would not be madder than hell? Time will tell what it will do to him politically, I know we all overreacted with the Blumenthal thing so it is hard to tell but I think we can agree that it does not help.  

Proud member of the Indiana Democratic Party from IN-9.  

[ Parent ]
Will this story
and stuff about Mark Kirk and David Vitter add up to an "untrustworthy" story against the GOP this fall?

party: Democratic, ideology: moderate, district: CT-01

No
In my opinion, it will not generalize beyond the candidates involved. How many people in North Carolina or Ohio do you think will have heard of those guys?

"I'm not a member of any organized political party, I'm a Democrat!"
--  Will Rogers  


[ Parent ]
Question
Why hasn't Rasmussen done an instant poll of this?

Because
its a Republican who got their hand caught in the cookie jar of course!

19, Male, Independent, CA-12

[ Parent ]

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