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SSP Daily Digest: 3/6

by: Crisitunity

Fri Mar 06, 2009 at 1:35 PM EST


• OH-Sen: Dennis Kucinich announced yesterday that he would not be a candidate for the open Senate seat in Ohio, saying he wanted to spend more time with his mothership. (D)

• WA-08: Darcy Burner makes it official that she won't be running a third time in WA-08; she throws her endorsement behind Suzan DelBene, another former Microsoft exec who hasn't run for office before. Don't expect DelBene to have the primary field to herself, though.

• CT-Gov: After a few years out of the spotlight, Ned Lamont is exploring a run for Connecticut governor. Jodi Rell hasn't decided whether she's going to run for re-election, and Lamont might also face a crowded Dem primary field.

• IL-Sen: The prospect of a special election to replace Roland Burris was unlikely, given the expense, and now it just got a lot unlikelier: a 3-2 party-line vote against the election in a state senate committee has effectively put the idea to bed.

• CO-Sen: The first Republican opponent for Michael Bennet (or another victor of a Democratic primary) has surfaced, and it's not the highest-profile guy around: Weld County District Attorney Ken Buck (who'd mostly been discussed as a challenger to Betsy Markey in CO-04). Ex-Rep. Bob Beauprez may be the GOP's top recruit left who's still interested, but he hasn't made anything official yet.

• Blue Dogs: The Blue Dog Coalition two years ago capped its enrollment at 20% of the Dem caucus, but they agreed to raise their limit to 21% to accommodate two additional members. New members include the four freshmen who ran under the Blue Dogs' endorsement (Bobby Bright, Parker Griffith, Frank Kratovil, and Walt Minnick), two veterans who've been on the waiting list (Henry Cuellar and Harry Mitchell), and two more last-minute additions thanks to the lifted cap (Glenn Nye and Jason Altmire). The NRCC has sent out a hilarious press release attacking vulnerable Democratic freshmen who didn't join the Blue Dogs (such as Larry Kissell), claiming that they were rejected for not meeting the Blue Dogs' litmus test for fiscal discipline, but the Blue Dogs, to their credit, fired back, saying that the representatives in question didn't ask to join.

• Votes: Speaking of Blue Dogs, they provided most of the defections on yesterday's 234-191 vote on the Helping Families Save Their Homes Act, which included the controversial mortgage modification provision. After all the agitas from Ellen Tauscher and other New Dems, they almost all voted yea. There were 24 Democratic nays, with Eric Massa probably the biggest surprise: also Mike Arcuri, Marion Berry, Dan Boren, Rick Boucher, Bobby Bright, Travis Childers, Kathy Dahlkemper, Lincoln Davis, Chet Edwards, Brad Ellsworth, Bart Gordon, Parker Griffith, Baron Hill, Tim Holden, Ron Kind, Larry Kissell, Frank Kratovil, Betsy Markey, Jim Matheson, Bart Stupak, Gene Taylor, and Harry Teague. (Big ups to Walt Minnick, who voted yea.) 7 Republican yeas: Mike Castle, Lincoln Diaz-Balart, Mario Diaz-Balart, Walter Jones, John McHugh, Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, and Jim Turner. (Joe Cao didn't vote.)

• TN-06: Democratic Rep. Bart Gordon gets a challenger: Dave Evans, a Major General in the United States Army Reserve. Rick Goddard 2.0? (J)
Crisitunity :: SSP Daily Digest: 3/6
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SSP Daily Digest: 3/6 | 105 comments
Who was the last dem governor of CT?

William O'Neill
But I had to look that up. It's been 18 years!
[ Parent ]
What's Lou Dobbs and Ralph Nader's Problem?
These two I've heard in the past few years are always complaining about the two party system. Seems to me, unofficially at least, there are three parties in Congress: Democrats, Republicans, and Blue Dogs.  
What about lizardfolk?


Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...
[ Parent ]
They're Blue Dogs
The exact species is called the Blue Dog Lizard or, by its scientific name, incredibleus painintheassus.

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.
[ Parent ]
haha
I have to say though, I love the Blue Dogs, although, I don't agree with them on much, especially most social issues. When the Democratic Party can count on 100% of its elected members voting exactly the same way, as the Republicans did on the Stimulus bill, we'll have found ourselves just like the Republicans, stuck in a huge electoral hole, without any way out in sight. And as I've said before, so long as they caucus democratic, and keep Dems in the majority, most scary socially conservative things will not be brought to a vote. And honestly, with the way a lot of socially progressive things have backtracked this past year, standing still is good for me.
[ Parent ]
I want cohesiveness
The Republicans failed not because of their cohesiveness.  It was because their ideas sucked and they got pasted for it.  Even the most maverick of the Republicans, like Shays and Chafee lost along with the most partisan, like Musgrave.

Cohesiveness, IMO, is actually what helped the Republicans.  It let them express an idea or set of ideas in a palpable way.

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.

[ Parent ]
I don't
All cohesiveness is is a bunch of idiot robots.

I too love the Blue Dogs, and the big tent of the Democratic Party.  Every Blue Dog who votes like I'd prefer they vote 50% of the time represents a drastic improvement over a wingnut who I would agree with les than 5% of the time.

Some people don't like to face reality, but large parts of this country have views that range between Mike Huckabee and Blue Dog.  They deserve representation, and I'm glad Blue Dogs represent them.

Of course I don't want a Blue Dog representing San Francisco or Manhattan, but there are few and far between of those folks.  (So looking forward to saying "Bye bye, DiFi.")

[ Parent ]
Cohesiveness
I for one think our party got stronger when Strom Thurmond left it, when Jesse Helms left, when Trent Lott left, when Virgil Goode left, when Zell Miller left, just like the Republican Party got stronger when the Reaganites gave it a strong, clear message.

The big tent can only accomodate so much.  

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.

[ Parent ]
No
You don't understand me... I mean, that if all the Democrats are thinking the same, its because we as a party will be limited to only the most liberal districts in the country, just as Republicans are mostly limited to the most conservative. And Republicans failed because the got RID of the big tent, they became the party of the Bible belt, and lost appeal to many all around the country, let me assure you, as a former Repubilcan from Los Angeles, this is exactly what happened to me, and millions of other like-minded-big-tent Republicans.
[ Parent ]
Here's another ex-Republican.


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[ Parent ]
Ditto for me
Though I have no problem voting and supporting many Republicans, I, too, am an ex Republican (though am an Independent and not Republican). And my dislike for the GOP isnt just social issues but economic as well. To me, if the GOP is still the party of 'extremely limited govt' in the realm of bread and butter issues (such as health care), even if it is socially moderate, I still wont like them. They need to moderate not just socially but fiscally, too.
[ Parent ]
I don't think they will moderate socially
they will eventually moderate economically because if they don't, they won't survive.

I think the "moderate Repub" 10 years from now will be a milder version of Mike Huckabee.

[ Parent ]
One other news item...
...my House Rep, Michael McMahon,  was named "Freshman Majority Whip" and is responsible for coordinating between leadership and the freshman class.

http://www.silive.com/news/ind...

On the "Helping Families Save Their Homes Act" I noticed since the last election and Obama's strong showing amoung Cubans Ileana Ros-Lehtinen has sounded a LOT more moderate than the past.  Interesting to see the Diaz-Balart brothers fresh off strong challenges joining her in embracing moderation aka trying to save their own necks.  This shows that the three of them don't see rising Cuban support for the Democratic Party as a passing fad.

he's a good politician isn't he
really entrenching himself quite nicely. I coudln't see even Dan Donovan beating him now, not in a district like that that votes on familiarity.

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
Probably a mixture of that
and that the FL housing market has completely collapsed.  Man, if I had an extra $100k lying around, I'd sure as shit be investing into a house in FL.  But I'll have to finish college first I spose...

I wonder how often they'll vote with us now as their districts trend away from the GOP and with big scares last time.

[ Parent ]
mortgage modification
The areas that would benefit the most from mortgage rescue are fast-growing suburbs full of new expensive residential subdivisions. There aren't a lot of those in the districts of the Dems who voted against it. There are a lot of those in the districts of the Reps who voted for it, especially the ones representing South Florida.
I'm surprised...
Shuler voted "yea" on the Helping Families Save Their Homes Act.
I'm not
the bill helps a lot of people in his district and in North Carolina.

A lot of these votes had to do with how it helps their districts...Massa voted no because he saw no benefit to his district.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens

[ Parent ]
That's a good observation
I hadn't noticed the correlation between the nay votes and the districts' low housing prices. With the exception of Markey and Matheson, it looks like most of those districts are ones where average housing prices probably never got very far into the six figures. There's not much in the way of overinflated ARMs in those districts to cram down.
[ Parent ]
BUT
look at the correlation the other way.  Instead of where the nay vote reflecting the housing market and instead to the housing market reflecting what type of representative is in that seat.

Most of the blue dogs come from rural areas where the housing market naturally doesn't see a $200,000 price tag or ever really get close to it.

I'd say the nay vote reflects their overall policy position (or one they choose to represent for their district's sake) with the housing markets they represent being the coincidence where they can be like, hey look I'm voting down crap that'll cost you but not benefit!  

Meh, Blue Dogs provide one huge benefit and one huge cost.

It really beefs up our numbers, it makes our majority look much more solid than it is, puts us in a better place of power, it'll keep us there for a lot longer as votes for Pelosi wont change, etc.  It looks good to have such a huge tent and have Dems from every area of the country instead of ceding all of rural America and the South to the GOP.

However, WHAT AN F'N WASTE OF MONEY!  They will never be the deciding votes on important legislation because they are the first to bail on us.  Are they really worth the money to keep around if we can maintain a smaller majority who votes more as a solid block which gets shit done?  Then, the DCCC money we save can be used to target seats where we can elect liberals.  But eventually, we'll win all those seats (there aren't many anyway) and have to go conservative and moderate Dems.

But if you look at who some Blue Dogs are, I mean Kathy Dahlkemper, district went 49/49, Markey's voted 49/50.  While there is obviously a disconnect from how their districts voted and how they probably really want their representative to vote, COME ON!  They nearly voted for Obama, they must be more willing than we assume to accept HIS policy agenda.

[ Parent ]
I'm surprised
populist Kissell didn't though.

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
Ultra-populism was a myth
Kissell represents a downscale district - I assume he just figured that teh bill didn't benefit his constituents enough - a bit shit, but in line with other represenatives in conservative districts.
[ Parent ]
Same reason
Kissel and Massa are quite populist, but not when it doesn't help their districts.

Eric Massa, for better or worse, focuses everything he does on the people of the 29th district of New York.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens

[ Parent ]
I have no problem with that
as long as their votes are not needed, and they are not on this bill.
[ Parent ]
Awesome
Why, exactly would DelBene fare any better then Burner? They have exactly the same profile. Trying the same thing over and over will get you the same results.

Disappointed that Nye joined the Blue Dogs. I'm glad that Kissell and Perriello didn't though!

I'm not familiar
With DelBene at all. But there is the possibility that she's a stronger candidate: a better speaker, a more savvy pol, hires better campaign staff. I wouldn't dismiss her solely based on the similar profile to Burner.
[ Parent ]
What difference does it make?
The Blue Dogs don't force people to vote one way or the other.  People like Mike Ross are loyal to the House leadership and don't force as much crap down people's throats at they like to pretend they do.

Having the Blue Dog helps you raise money and it gives you something to put in your ads, not a big deal one way or the other.

Please donate to amcharities.org to help build more after school centers in the Miami area.  

[ Parent ]
Blue Dog nowadays
means Democrat in Republican-leaning district. Although Obama won Nye's district, it's still pretty conservative. Nye hasn't cast any votes to make me believe he will be any more conservative than a Blue Dog like Steve Israel or Bill Foster.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
A huge difference
The Blue Dogs defect, as a caucus, far more than New Democrats or any other group.  It is the Blue Dogs who are trying to formalize W's looting of Social Security by cutting benefits and raising the retirement age because total expenditures would have to be raised to pay back the $2.5 trillion borrowed from Social Security.  In about half of these districts, they are not good but as good as we could expect.  In the other half, they are a drag.

Blue Dogs like Gene Taylor are fine.  Leonard Boswell?  We could do better.  Jim Cooper?  We could do much better from his 56% Obama district in Nashville.  He's a long term mill stone.

One more thing.  In 2006 when the DCCC made a big push to retake the House majority, Blue Dogs failed to pull their own weight.  The existing Blue Dogs ate up nearly as much money as they contributed.  All those conservative Democrats were elected on the money of progressive and moderate Dems.

[ Parent ]
All of them?
I don't remember Steve Israel or Mike Michaud looking to loot Social Security...did they?

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
Why is Michaud a Blue Dog?
Does he vote against the leadership on conservative ground on much at all?  
I know that he opposed two major pieces of Dem legislation in 2007-2008, the bill to withdraw from Iraq, which he opposed because it didn't withdraw all the troops, and ENDA, which he claimed to oppose because it didn't cover transgendered people.  
[ Parent ]
No one knows
my only guess is that Michaud is pro-life and that's the reasoning...or also because when he joined in 2003, Maine-2 looked like a swing district he needed to hold

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
Oddly enough
In his initial 2002 election Michaud was the pro-life candidate and his republican opponent was the pro-choice candidate.  Michaud won 52-48 and has been re-elected easily since.
[ Parent ]
A lot of Blue Dogs
It seems that a lot of Dem congressmen in moderate districts joined the Blue Dogs initially in order to appear moderate.  There are plenty of examples of "Blue Dogs in Name Only."  
[ Parent ]
Arcuri
Michael Arcuri has the most liberal voting record of any Blue Dog with a Progressive Punch score of over 93.  As I said, about half of the Blue Dogs are not super conservative.  Blue Dogs cover about 49 points on the Progressive Punch scale ranging from Walt Minnick (44) to Michael Arcuri.  By contrast, the entire Republican Party in the House ranges from 0 to 23 (Chris Smith of NJ) and that range has been steadily shrinking.

There are close to 25 or 30 hard core Blue Dog votes.  Many of these get frequent air time on cable Tv and nmentions in the newspapers taking stabs at the national Democratic Party (Gene Taylor for one clearly does not.  Charelie Melancon states what he's for and is close to crossing the line but he's probably OK).

The Blue Dogs with their insistence on screwing around with Social Security are the major threat to continued Democratic dominance in the House.  Under current rules, the Blue Dogs are the opposition party in the House while Republicans just say no again and again.

[ Parent ]
I agree
There are times when votes against the progressive accumulate or when they become so heinous that "voting my district" is no longer an excuse.  Surely to god Bobby Bright's district isn't against pay equity for women like Bright was.  Surely the eight district of Georgia isn't against healthcare for poor kids like Jim Marshall is.  Surely to god the second district of Florida doesn't support Bush's privatization scheme for social security.

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.
[ Parent ]
I'd be willing to bet
Bright's district opposes pay equity for women, Marshall's district opposes SCHIP and Boyd's district wants to get rid of Social Security...it's really nutty down there.

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
Not so in GA
Marshall's vote was widely viewed as stupid and out of touch. He represents a lot of poor families who benefit from the SCHIP program and who gladly support that program. That's not an issue any Democrat would lose on anywhere.

Check out Georgia's best progressive political blog
[ Parent ]
I can think of maybe a handful of
wealthy suburban districts where SCHIP probably gets a majority opposition, maybe a district in the Dallas or Houston suburbs, maybe a district in Orange County (which Obama came close to winning), maybe LA-1, maybe AL-6, maybe a district in the Atlanta suburbs.  Not much more beyond that.
[ Parent ]
In my district
Which is Pete Olson's and the steriotypical conservative suburban distrrict, i would assume many here would support SCHIP. This is an area with many, many evangelicals and evangelicals and many of them are quite economically populist. Sure you have some 'country club' evangelicals who may be diehard conservatives on not just social but economic issues, as well (such as old school Religious Right leaders), but many evangelicals are pretty good on issues like health care and poverty. And theres many Catholics (including white, latino and asians) who Id assume would be economically populist, too.
[ Parent ]
Even in the deep south...
I assume that many working class whites, who are traditionally yellow dog Dem but now support the Republicans at least federally, would also support SCHIP. Sure, they may not be as economically populist as working class whites in places like NE Ohio and metro Detroit and West Virginia but they still have some populism in them I would think.
[ Parent ]
I doubt either one of their district
even as wingnut as they are oppose either of those bills.

Outside of a few wealthy suburban districts, no district, not even the conservative solid Repub ones, wants to privatize Social Security or opposed SCHIP.  These positions are less popular than Bush.

[ Parent ]
Soc. Sec. privitization
There was a time when I supported private accounts for Soc. Sec....but that was before the market went down the tubes. Now Im on the other side and just cant support it. Not now, not ever. Even in boom times I just cant support it...because those times may not last forever and we could see everyone's retirement going down the Wall Street drain.
[ Parent ]
In 2005 Long Island
I could find one person Republican or Democrat who DIDN'T think privatizing Social Security was a good idea...I was alone in arguing against it.

Granted they're happy it didn't happen.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens

[ Parent ]
Funny
because here in Pennsylvania, I couldn't find many who was for Bush's plan to privatize it.  Some young Repubs were for it, but even the Repubs over 40 were dead set against it.
[ Parent ]
It's just so interesting
Everyone over 40, dont you dare screw with my social security by putting into the free market.

Why doesn't that translate to, dont you dare screw with my wages/job security/employment/prices which all translates into well being, with the free market.

Well, the real problem is we dont live in a free market whatsoever.  Our society is too advanced to have a real free market because the things we need (health insurance, loans) can't come from anything but really a large corporation.  We cant free market it because it's costly and needs to be run at a large level, but we didn't let the government then take over and we instead allowed them to be way worse with monopolies.  And then Wal Mart and the like just screwed everything up even more so.  Obama is going to change all that, :)  Hilda Solis, best pick period.

[ Parent ]
Hilda is definitely awesome!
And I even got to chat with her a couple of years back. http://firedoglake.com/2007/06...

And here is a (albeit 5-year-old) snapshot of life in a "total free market": http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wor...

Check out the 2010 California races (http://2010californiaracetracker.wetpaint.com) and help us take back Red California! (http://www.takebackredcalifornia.org)

[ Parent ]
It WAS a generational thing
As you said, it was mostly those under 40 who were supportize of Bush's social security privatization.  Not surprising considering that was the demographic of people who had seen the stock market do almost nothing but go up at a big rate.  They had seen few if any recessions prior to 2007-present.  It was the seniors who lived through countless deep recessions and some even a depression who were the backbone of opposition to privatization and effectively killed the plan in it's tracks.

I think we're in for a period of a good decade or longer where even the mere mention of social security privatization by any politician in a sane district will be career suicide.  

[ Parent ]
Not surprising.
My grandfather who turns 87 in May and has memories of the Great Depression strongly opposes SS privatization.

And though I'm 26, I too strongly oppose SS privatization.

"Should any political party try to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes that you can do these things. Among them are H.L. Hunt (you possibly know his background), a few other Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or business man from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid."

Check out the 2010 California races (http://2010californiaracetracker.wetpaint.com) and help us take back Red California! (http://www.takebackredcalifornia.org)

[ Parent ]
Long Island
is economically VERY conservative...even though it votes Democratic, it's really only because of social issues and corruption. Nassau County's Democratic DA only won because she's pro-choice and the Republican incumbent was rabidly pro-life. Suffolk County's Democratic DA is cross-endorsed by the Conservative Party.

But as far as taxes and labor go, especially in Nassau County, it's Orange County East.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens

[ Parent ]
DA
People voting for or against a DA because of abortion? You have got to be kidding. I guess theres some issues involving abortion that a DA decides/decides not to take up...but those are so few and far between.
[ Parent ]
That was the top issue
There was also the issue that Denis Dillon plea bargined too many cases and Kathleen Rice had her no-tolerance for drunk driving campaign which gained steam after a little girl was killed in a drunk driving accident on the Meadowbrook Parkway

but in the end Rice won largely because she received the votes for pro-choice Republican women.

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens

[ Parent ]
Hold on
I though LI was pretty pro-labor, even their Repubs are pro-labor.  Peter King is a cosponsor of the Employee Free Choice Act, and in 1995 caught a lot of flack for saying that he would rather deal with AFL-CIO leader John Sweeney than Gingrich.
[ Parent ]
eh
labor is a political force in parts of Long Island, but labor issues are not really as popular as you'd think...but concerning taxes and spending, the people there are VERY conservative. It's the only reason they keep sending Republicans to the state legislature.

The State Senate was in GOP hands for so long because until 2007, and for over 40 years, every State Senator on the Island was Republican. Now there are two Democrats...one in Nassau County, but he represents the North shore which is VERY liberal (though not on taxes and spending) and one in Central Suffolk County, which is probably the most economically liberal area on the Island.

The only good thing for Democrats is that the public blames the decades-long Republican rule for their high taxes.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens

[ Parent ]
Over 50?
Plenty of people here in Jersey thought the idea was nuts but then again many of my neighbors, etc were in their fifties.  We've seen the market tank before.  It lost 40% right around 1987 almost overnight.

This is the NJ district with the most Republican PVI (R+6).

Same thing happened over a little slower time in the early 70s when the market also lost around 40% over a few years bottoming out in the 600s.

[ Parent ]
The stock market drop in the 1970s
was effectively a crash.  The market went down from over a 1000 to 650, officially, but inflation decreased real value of the dollar by 60%, so effectively it was equal to the stock market dropping to 350.
[ Parent ]
Obama got 43% in Marshall's district
and 45% in Boyd's.  These are conservative districts, but not ideologically so to oppose SCHIP or Social Security.
[ Parent ]
That's BS
The Blue Dogs can be maddening at times but they never attempted to push W's social security privatization scam.  As far as I'm aware the only Blue Dog to say anything even positive about the plan was Boyd.  If the Blue Dogs had been on board with Bush's plan it may well have passed.  The fact that it never even came up for a vote should tell you how much support it had.
[ Parent ]
It's a liar's caucus
It'f for self proclaimed 'rebels'. As in one sixth posers, one xith socially halfway-liberal Republicans, one sixth Dixeicrats, one sixth cowardly Dixeiecrats and one half 'deficit hawks' who lovoe wasteful defence spending.

It's the almost-Republican caucus. Why else would they criticise members for not joining?

[ Parent ]
they didn't criticize
anyone for not joining, Republicans used it as an attack line.

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
and there are a lot of Bluedogs
a full fifth of the caucus. Most of them vote pretty good, there's simply a large group of very conservative members. I don't want a unified, unilateral party dominated by one exact viewpoint though, then we'd be like the Republicans.

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
Nor do I
Contrary to what my postings above may indicate, I don't want mindless lockstepping.  I'm a liberal, but I have problems with abortion (I see both sides' arguments as very true), and I support the death penalty (although I firmly believe there should be more safeguards.

However, there I do think there should be some form of cohesion.  What's the point of being a Democrat if you're going to vote against the general Democratic response all the time?

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.

[ Parent ]
Abortion
Im pretty culturally liberal myself (including pro-gay marriage, pro pot legalization, etc) and while pro-choice I do consider myself moderate on it, supporting parental notification and against partial birth abortion. In fact Id consider myself against abortion pretty much when the fetus is viable (obviously theres cases when id be for it).  
[ Parent ]
Let's stop there... (no offense)
I know this is a semi-open thread but really the abortion comments back and forth are really unnecessary. It's a divisive subject to say the least...

Check out Georgia's best progressive political blog
[ Parent ]
we're getting a good
honest discussion going on here.

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
There are lots of better places
To discuss personal views on abortion. You want to talk the politics of abortion, that's a different story.
[ Parent ]
My bad
My bad then. I'll try to stay more on topic.
[ Parent ]
Just goes to show that there is a continuum of views
that's not well-served by anyone who insists on an all-or-nothing policy argument.

Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...
[ Parent ]
They don't
They don't vote against the general response. The least progressive Democrat (Minnick) is still more progressive than the most progressive Republican.
[ Parent ]
the same with the Senate
That's what all the hateful, delusional comments about Blue Dogs fail to grasp somehow.

No matter what, there will always be one person who is the least "left" Democrat.  Only fools want to shun/expel whoever that person is, because then it means expelling the next least "left" and so on.

Party unity is a stupid concept.  I want people who generally feel similarly, or at the very least, feel less similar to the other large group (Republicans) who feel similarly.  If someone favors the death penalty, fine.  If another person favors a flat tax, fine.  As long as they generally favor a positive, freedom-based, non-prejudiced way of dealing with the world, they are welcome.  I might like someone better in a primary, and sometimes even in a general election, but if they self-identify with the broad Democratic party principles, welcome.

[ Parent ]
I agree, though I am
beginning to have my doubts about Bright, I think he would switch to Republican in a heartbeat if Democrats were not the majority. He's voted no on just about all Democratic issues, including both stimulus packages, children's health care, mortage relief, both lillybedetter acts, the employment equality act, he's only voted with a majority of Democrats twice.  

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
He surprised me last week
He voted for the budget.
[ Parent ]
Did he really?
That's a surprise.  Weird that he'd vote against things like S-CHIP that would hurt him little to none in voting for yet he votes for the budget that republicans will no doubt hammer him for in 2010, claiming it raises taxes.
[ Parent ]
Read it and Weep
[ Parent ]
Heh
Has there ever been a spending bill that Don Young has voted against?  Even Democratic bills he tends to vote for.  As bad ethically as he is he's miles better than the Palin wing of the AK republican party.

Speier's name sticks out as the only real liberal to vote against it.  Wonder what her problem with the budget was.  She's pretty darn liberal.  Must not have gotten something in the bill that she wanted.

[ Parent ]
She's anti-earmark
apparently. It's interesting, but I imagine she only did it because she knew the budget was going to pass.
Maybe she has buzz that DiFi is going to retire in 2012 and she's trying to moderate he record a bit to position herself for that? She ran for Lt. Governor in 2006, so she's obviously ambitious. In any event, she certainly wouldn't have that primary to herself.
[ Parent ]
Hmmm
I prefer Loretta Sanchez
[ Parent ]
I prefer Susan Davis


Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
[ Parent ]
I prefer
LINDA Sanchez, though she's probably the least electable of the four names that have been randomly thrown out.
[ Parent ]
Two is exactly two more than the Rep
would have voted.

Those two votes are gravy.  Even if he were to switch if the Republicans changed, fine, who cares.  He's better than the other guy would have been so don't cry about how he isn't Nadler.

Also, while it may not seem so important, his vote in organizing the house is helpful.  A LOT of republicans are discouraged about being in the minority for the next decade, and are retiring or not running.  An extra ten votes from the most conservative Blue Dogs is a very significant thing in that way.

Any vote we ever-ever-ever get from a +17R district is freaking golden.

[ Parent ]
I'm sorry, but you're asking for a joke
"I've got this progressive vote on a bill comin' from an R+17 district and it's f'in GOLDEN!"

Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...
[ Parent ]
Except...
that Republican would not cost us a million dollars in DCCC money that would be better served going to more progressive candidates in better districts. Which is the point I've made all along. If you can hold your district easily, vote however you want. If you need help, you'd better be ready to vote with the Democrats more than 10% of the time. This is why I don't think the "better than a Republican, if only just" argument doesn't hold water here.
[ Parent ]
Bright
Last I looked, Bright had a progressive punch score of a little over 50, which is about 50 points higher than Republicans elected from similar districts.  

Bright is always going to be a target and need DCCC help. But, the NRCC will be spending money there as well as long as he's the incumbent.  If they ever elect an R to that district, they won't spend a penny on it.

As long as he's loyal to the party (e.g. doesn't loudly say stupid things undermining D issues), then I'm happy for the DCCC to support him.  It's probably as good a return on investment as anywhere else.

[ Parent ]
No
Investing in disticts like MN-3, MN-6, OH-12, OH-14, NY-3, NY-26, PA-15, FL-10 are a better return.  Democrats elected to those seats will actually vote with us on issues when it matters.

Bright being in our caucus is only good for tv purposes and from looking at a map.  It's good to have people in our caucus from all over, but other seats are much better investments.

[ Parent ]
Don't be so sure
It's entirely possible that Democrats elected in those districts will be similar to Democrats like Chris Carney, Mike Arcuri or Heath Shuler. I wouldn;'t be surprised if each of those districts gives us a Blue Dog.  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
Bright
If Bright has a 50 Prog. Punch score. right now...I imagine itll be alot less by the end of the year. People should take into account which bills have been voted on. Theyve mostly been economic bills. Hot button social issue bills have largely been avoided so far. And Bright is supposedly much more conservative on social issues. And, most of those economic bills arent unpopular. Theyre relatively easy bills for a Dem to vote aye on. And Bright's is now at around 59%.
[ Parent ]
And if Democrats control Congress
I'll bet that social issues don't come up (much).

Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...
[ Parent ]
One more election
I have a strong feeling that Bright is only going to be costly for one, maybe two more election cycles.  After that he could well turn out to be a Gene Taylor type who costs us little to nothing to defend.  

I'd put Childers in the same category.  He seems to be playing very well in his district.  Hopefully he wins easily again in 2010 and scare off all future challengers.

[ Parent ]
In more ways than one
It's nonsense to say only 10% of the time.  It's nonsense to say he'll cost a million dollars every cycle.  It's nonsense to say that the people in that district don't deserve the same level of respect that MN-3 or whereever else.

It may be a message lost on the lockstep/unity leftnuts, but a 50 state strategy also is 435 district one.  Bright's district is just about the most hard core conservative district in the country.  It's not the Texas panhandle, Chet Edwards district or Kansas-1, where racism and hatred have not ruled harshly for generations.  Progress takes time, and getting people to pull the (D) lever again is a battle.

In hard red districts, very conservative Democrats who wote with the bulk of the party 40 to 50% of the time are in many ways the most important to cherish, true "progressives" out there.  This country has some mega-crappy history, especially in the deep south.  Moving the non-hating right of the country a little bit left each year is a very important element of social change.

[ Parent ]
They're not conservative Democrats anymore
They are full blown Republicans and enough of them found one last Democrat they can support.  If his margins start to go up and we dont have to fight for this seat every time (very conceivable), then whatev.

But whatev, that seat belongs to a Republican, point blank period.  We're on borrowed time and questioning the investment into something on borrowed time is legit.  I'd say though it has yet to be seen which way it will go, will he be worth it or not.  So far I'd say yeah, we'll see come election season.

[ Parent ]
i'd say blue dogs represent districts that don't trust government
urban and inner ring suburban districts do and their representatives are the core of the house caucus.

but democrats have lost many of those blue dog districts at many levels in the last 25 years because people there don't trust the government to spend their money wisely.  blue dog has become short-hand for "fiscally conservative,"  though many are also culturally conservative in relation to the democratic caucus.

we need them to have our majority and enough of them vote right often enough to make it work.

Happy that IL took the special election off the table.  It was a dumb idea.  If Burris resigns, Quinn can put in a placeholder (who's not abhorrent), and the "special election" will be in 2010, when it should be.

interesting all
the Cuban Republicans voted yea, and Wlater Jones has become so moderate compared to how he used to be. And, I'm not going to give Childers any flack, he's been a great Representative over all, voting for both versions of the Stimulus act and SCHIP, and all sorts of other big measures in the last congress. He's a great congressman considering the kind of area he represents and the kind of target he still has on his back.

Call no man happy until he is dead-Aeschylus
Yeah after watching Right America: Feeling Wronged...
I am amazed someone like Childers who is a pretty decent Democrat was elected there. Oxford, MS is no liberal bastion even though Ole Miss is there and William Faulkner once lived there...

Check out Georgia's best progressive political blog
[ Parent ]
I get the sense that Jones
might be considering a party switch if he could get away with it in his district.  He used to be a socially conservative populist Democrat, and switched parties only in 1993 before he ran for Congress.  In his heart, he is really only conservative on social issues, and he probably came to the conclusion after W that the Repubs as a whole were not so competent on the other issues.
[ Parent ]
Iraq
I remember how he use to be the 'freedom fries' guy and then really turned on the war. So maybe he is just socially conservative now.
[ Parent ]
Pretty much
He, along with Ron Paul were the first two republicans to oppose the war.  Well actually I think there was a Tennessee rep as well.  If his district was even marginally less republican I have no doubt he'd have switched parties by now.
[ Parent ]
Amo Houghton too.
Then you look at the jackass who replaced him and well...
[ Parent ]
Yeah well he's out of the office now
Eric Massa has Houghton's district  

Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
From above average to crap to great.

[ Parent ]
John Duncan


Liberty Avenue Politics - a place for politics in Southern Queens
[ Parent ]
Duncan's district
Is ancestrally Republican (literally!). Being a Democrat there, in East Tennessee, is pretty much anathema. So definitely not a surprise that he never considered switching.
[ Parent ]
Ya, it's a strange thing
That part of Tennessee seems to have been the most pro-union region in the entire south during the Civil War, and only elected a Democrat for one or two terms to the U.S. House in that entire span of 140+ years.  Very weird considering how many party re-alignments have happened since that time.  
[ Parent ]
Is time slower in the South
or something?

Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...
[ Parent ]
They certainly have long memories

[ Parent ]
SSP Daily Digest: 3/6 | 105 comments

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