If Martin wins the race

and assuming that we win VA, NM, CO, NH, OR, AK, NC, and MN, we will have our 60 seats.  What will the Democrats do in regards to Joe Lieberman?  I'm not a fan of Lieberman, but do we keep him in the caucus or do we kick him out and allow the GOP to take our 60th seat?

Politics make strange bedfellows.  I will say this, having Musgrove lose doesn't bother me all that much.  He's very conservative, about the only type of Democrat that can win Mississippi in a statewide election.  I could see Musgrove being a major thorn within the Democratic Caucus.

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by: Tarheeman1993 @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:18:21 PM CDT

Take away his chairmanship.

  Let him leave the party himself.  It will be hilarious to see him leave a party which just won the presidency and large majorities in Congress.

John McCain lets lobbyists shape his economic policy

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by: cilerder86 @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:27:42 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

If Lieberman Is Punished

I think he'll have little choices anyway. I mean, it's not likely he'll run again, and to end his career having switch to the GOP is not a good way to go especially if they're in the minority.

Although, Lieberman may just do it out of spite to deny the Democrats 60 seats, leaving them with like 59 or something.

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by: Don't Tase Me, Bro! @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:41:12 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Good idea

To take away his chairmanship.  I think Joltin Joe is with us on almost all issues except for foreign policy.  He fits more in line with the Dems.  

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by: Tarheeman1993 @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:45:35 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Lieberman is with us quite a bit

He'll be with us on domestic issues more often than not.  It's only on foreign policy that he breaks ranks frequently, and he won't have as many opportunities to once Obama is Commander in Chief.

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by: ChadInFL @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:28:28 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Two Points

First, voting to stop a filibuster is unlike voting for majority leader in that there's no guarantee of party unity on either side and every vote will be unique with different alliances.  So, the 60 Democrat magic number is really more symbolic than real.  Every additional Democratic Senator is important, but there's nothing special about 60 Democrats--there's only something special about 60 senators willing to vote cloture on any particular issue.  In that sense, whether we have 58, 59, 60, or 61 Democratic Senators, getting Lieberman's vote is potentially the difference on any cloture vote.

Second, whether we kick Lieberman out of the caucus or not, will likely not affect how he votes on most filibusters.  If it's a domestic question, he'll likely vote with the Democrats.  If it's foreign, he'll likely vote with the Republicans.  If you kick him out, he might, just maybe, be more inclined to vote with the Republicans on a particular issue.  But, for most he's gonna do what he's gonna do no matter what happens between him and the caucus.

Personally, I'm inclined to strip him of his chairmanship and kick him out of the caucus.  He certainly did the party no favors in failing to investigate Bush malfeasances in the last two years and I don't think he'll do the Obama administration any favors as chair of Homeland Security.  It also makes clear that he's not part of the party so that republicans cannot use him as effectively to say there is bipartisan support for their positions or candidates.  Finally, there should be adverse consequences for campaigning against Obama and the things he's said; perhaps the next Lieberman will think twice before doing the same.

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by: sicembears @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:16:13 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Big pro and con for a run-off

If this is the seat that would put us at 60, we would face a VERY hard time to win, as the GOP would put that right in front of the Georgia voters.  Given an Obama win, they would likely vote for divided government.  

The biggest issue is Obama himself.  If he goes all in to get Jim Martin the W, then Martin has his best shot.  We will need Obama engaged.  The problem is that he might be nervous getting too involved, because if he does and Martin still loses, Obama's caches takes a hit before he even takes office.  I hope he doesn't feel that way, but I guarantee you his people will be thinking about it.  

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by: Andy Dufresne @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:20:41 PM CDT

One idea

that I've been mulling over is that if we find ourselves at 59, perhaps Obama should pull a moderate blue-state Republican out of the Senate and drop them into one of the less important Cabinet positions (like how Spitzer and Strickland cut down GOP margins in their legislatures). The most intuitive selection, I suppose, would be take Olympia Snowe and put her in Commerce, and let Gov. Baldacci appoint Tom Allen (or himself) to the empty Senate seat. Voila, you're at 60, and you've gotten to burnish your bipartisan credentials along the way.

So I guess in this Georgia runoff scenario, the question is, if Obama is at 59 prior to the Georgia runoff, should he pull the trigger on appointing Snowe (or, gack, Collins) to the Cabinet and take the whole 'stop them from getting 60' issue off the table in Georgia by virtue of already being at 60? That would defuse the best GOP argument... although conversely it might limit Democratic enthusiasm for going all in on Martin (which then could get us to 61, and the Lieberman-less promised land).

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by: Crisitunity @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:38:53 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Interesting idea

If I were advising Obama, I would tell him to wait to do that until after the run-off.  Go all out on that first.  I think we will be able to easily out-fundraise the dead and depleted NRSC.  And if Obama were to hold a fundraiser, Martin would probably have more than Chambliss!  

I really believe that if Obama went all-in here and made the race his first political mission, he could get Martin the win.  It won't be easy, especially if we are at 59, but it is worth it.  

In terms of your cabinet idea, it is sad that there will literally be one Senator left who we could consider.  I think Specter is too old to leave or join the cabinet, and Collins is more partisan.  Literally, with Coleman and Smith losing, the Senate GOP, like the House, will be nearly all right-wingers.  

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by: Andy Dufresne @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:50:21 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Collins

my money is on her running for Governor when Baldacci is up in 2010.  that was her first ambition, and she has never really gotten over losing in 1994.

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by: CarnahanDemocrat @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:32:51 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

It's worth considering

Although I think there's a chance Snowe might switch parties.

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.

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by: TheUnknown285 @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 20:38:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

It's possible

If there were one party switcher I think Snowe is the most likely.  She could get away with it and still cruise to re-election in the future if she wanted to.

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by: ChadInFL @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 21:00:13 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Snowe would never switch

as a Mainer, its clear that she is devoted to the old New England Republican ideal.  She personally believes it is her responsibility to hold onto this ideal and to try to bring the Republicans back to the center.

Not to mention, her deceased husband was a Republican US Congressman and her current husband is a former Republican Governor of Maine.

Maybe she would accept a cabinet position, just not sure which one.  maybe labor.

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by: CarnahanDemocrat @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:27:49 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I agree

I mean, what does Commence really do? The least he can do is offer it to her and she might at the very least be happy about it and vote with us more often.

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by: Populista @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 20:49:46 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Snow (or other) in the Cabinet

If there is no winner (above 50%) on Tuesday, I think there is virtually no chance that Martin could/would win a run-off.  GA remains a very conservative state.  Also this is not a matter of money.  By the time a run-off would occur, the dust would settle and Repubs would focus on a stop-Obama-Pelosi-Reid campaign.  Also a special and/or run-off election typically has fewer voters than does a standard presidential election.  I just don't think Martin can win a run off.

Crisitunity's idea strikes me as one of only two viable ones.  The only other would be to defeat Chambliss on Tuesday with an over 50% vote.  To accomplish that, the DSCC would need to jump in with both feet PDQ.

As for 61 unless either KY or MS turns around, I think this would have to wait until 2010 unless some Repub can be induced to jump the fence.  

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by: Boston Raven @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 21:13:24 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

If we somehow won the IN Governorship

I'd highly recommend nominating Dick Lugar to a cabinet position.  He's very knowledgable on foreign policy and universally respected by democrats and republicans alike.  

Grassley (IA) is another possibility.  With the right job offer he would probably consider a cabinet appointment.

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by: ChadInFL @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 21:28:54 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Grassley

might like to do Agriculture. Talk about putting the fox (Archer Daniels Midland, in this case) in charge of the henhouse, though.

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by: Crisitunity @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:16:56 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

I'm Skeptical About Your Idea

First, I would not want Obama to compromise his administration.  He needs people in place who are competent, team players, and sympathetic to whatever policies Obama pushes for the particular department.

Second, would any Republican Senator want to serve in the Obama administration, especially if we're talking about a lower profile cabinet position?  It would need to be a department he or she had some expertise and interest in.

Third, I would think there would be lots and lots of pressure on any Republican Senator who would be replaced by a Democrat NOT to resign.  It would probably need to be someone with no further elective ambitions.

Not a bad idea if there were a good fit, but I cannot think of anyone off the top of my head.

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by: sicembears @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:26:34 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

some who would accept cabinet positions

Grassley would gladly take the head of Treasury if offered (not that he's a good choice).  He hates the minority.

Judd Gregg is also a potential Cabinet pick.  

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by: CarnahanDemocrat @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:31:44 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Sure, agree somewhat on all three

One problem with a GOPer at Commerce is that Commerce oversees the Census Bureau, and I don't really want a Republican in charge of the 2010 census.

Snowe is ranking member on Small Business, and also on Commerce, so that's her area of expertise. It's kind of a Cabinet backwater, though, so yeah, it might be too small potatoes for her to want to leave the prestige of the Senate, especially if she feels like she's better served to be the last voice of sanity as the Senate GOP drives off the cliff.

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by: Crisitunity @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:50:12 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

If Jill Long Thompson

Had a snowball's chance in hell of winning, this could be a scenario I see. Obama and Dick Lugar get along great and I could see Obama appointing him to be Sec. of State and have JLT put someone in that seat.

I seriously question whether Olympia Snowe would leave the Senate to be commerce secretary or secretary of the interior.

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by: safi @ Wed Oct 29, 2008 at 01:40:59 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

I would be

extremely pleased with Lugar as SoS as long as he adheres to Obama's policies.  But that is a solid Republican choice for a good cabinet position.  Can JLT pull it off...  ::sigh::  Wonder who she would pick then to fill the seat, Ellsworth?

Obama should almost just pick Lugar anyway, bi-partisan and deservedly.  He'd have two of the best foreign policy experts guiding him.

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by: Andrew @ Wed Oct 29, 2008 at 08:38:19 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

Not Likely to Happen

I was pushing this idea a week ago, but read somewhere recently that Lugar has said he would not leave the Senate to take a spot with the Obama administration.  Perhaps that's just talk and he'll change his mind after the election, but it didn't sound like it.

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by: sicembears @ Wed Oct 29, 2008 at 16:27:40 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Martin won't win a runoff

All those Libertarian voters will probably fall back to Chambliss. But, assuming Martin can somehow appeal to that vote and President-elect Obama comes down to Georgia for one last campaign stop (that'll be outrageous, wonder if McCain will come stump for Saxby), Martin may have a slim chance.

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by: Don't Tase Me, Bro! @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:45:22 PM CDT

I agree

Part of the reason he's doing so well thus far seems to be the fact that many in GA don't know how liberal he is because this race is flying under the radar.  If it goes to a run-off the voters will be well aware.

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by: ChadInFL @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 19:55:28 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Especially If Obama makes an appearance

I just realized this.

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by: Don't Tase Me, Bro! @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 20:37:28 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

Similar thing to what I said about SC-01

Stop making a big deal of it, basically.

Well, personally, I haven't actually checked out Martin's positions, and political opinion isn't something that can be easily confirmed or denied (like sexuality).  Though, given that second part of my last sentence (that opinion isn't easily confirmed/denied), it's all about the perception of it.  A rather liberal or conservative politician can be painted as moderate, a moderate can be painted as liberal or conservative, with a heavy paint job.

Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...

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by: Glenn Magus Harvey @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 20:45:41 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

The runoff is going to be insane

I wouldn't be at all surprised if each side spends 10 million just during the runoff period. Biz groups will do everything beacuse that will be the 60th vote for EFCA and they could probably pick one one Dem or Specter. And Obama and the Dems will go all out for the same reasons, we want 60 votes.

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by: Populista @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 20:48:47 PM CDT

The argument I hope Martin would make in the runoff

"Who do you think can better get things done for Georgia?"

Saxby Chambliss doesn't have much seniority and will be in a very weak minority caucus in which his party is also in a very weak position in the House and out of power in the White House.  Replacing Chambliss with Martin gives Georgians a voice within the party that's in power.  

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.

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by: TheUnknown285 @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 20:49:38 PM CDT

I don't think seniority and caucus power are huge bonuses

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I doubt that seniority and caucus power are that big of issues with people.  I mean, people probably see them as nice perks but only minor reasons to vote for a certain candidate.

Bill Posey is not half-alligator...and is outclassed by Davy Crockett anyway: http://www.washingtonmonthly.c...

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by: Glenn Magus Harvey @ Wed Oct 29, 2008 at 00:45:17 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

You have to make it one

The Republicans are going to trot out their "stop the Democrat [sic] monopoly on power."  You have to fight back.  Make sure the people know that a Martin will more likely have the ear of Obama and the Senate leadership and can thus get more things done that Chambliss could, especially considering his partisan nature.

Follow the elections in Georgia at the 2010 Georgia Race Tracker.

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by: TheUnknown285 @ Wed Oct 29, 2008 at 09:55:36 AM CDT

[ Parent ]

DSCC new ad on Saxby's Sugar Connections

http://www.progressiveelectora...

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by: politicalal @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 21:23:33 PM CDT

That's not an ad.

That's a 2:14 minute web video.

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by: James L. @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 21:25:35 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

it's still an Ad technically

it's not going up on the air, but it's quite a slam at Sugar Saxby

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by: politicalal @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 21:41:10 PM CDT

There's a fine difference between the two, that's why James is making the distinction

So no, it isn't an ad.  It isn't going to hit the Atlanta media market at all.  

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by: JeremiahTheMessiah @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 22:37:23 PM CDT

[ Parent ]

what's the point of these videos?

how many people will see them?

i'm sure they will use part of this for a 30-sec ad though right?

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by: politicalal @ Tue Oct 28, 2008 at 23:19:28 PM CDT

[ Parent ]